Reply by Jerry Avins September 30, 20082008-09-30
dbell wrote:

   ...

>> Hi, >> as far as I know, solutions manuals are for professors, not >> for students. Homework problems, created by a book's >> author, are exceedingly time-consuming to prepare, and >> having ready-made homework problems/solutions save a >> professor an awful lot of time. >> >> My recollection is that completing homework problems >> counted for a *substantial* part of students grade, as >> opposed to a "small percentage". If a student failed to >> complete their homework problems, it seems to me that >> they'd have to "ace" the tests just to receive a "C" grade.
... At CCNY in the late 50s, solution manuals were included with some of the textbooks at the college store. Whether or not was the instructor's option. They were rarely available with books that contained solutions to odd (say) numbered problems, and almost always included with texts that had no or few solutions in the back. Every once in a while, I review part of an old text. The solution manual is then very welcome. Most instructors graded homework in an odd way. Generally, turned-in homework was an optional extra that could help a grade if help was needed. Jerry -- Engineering is the art of making what you want from things you can get. ����������������������������������������������������������������������� ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **
Reply by John O'Flaherty September 30, 20082008-09-30
On Mon, 29 Sep 2008 13:32:20 GMT, R.Lyons@_Bogus_ieee.org (Rick Lyons)
wrote:

>On Sat, 27 Sep 2008 16:33:26 -0500, John O'Flaherty ><quiasmox@yeeha.com> wrote: > >>On Fri, 26 Sep 2008 20:11:12 -0500, Jack Klein <jackklein@spamcop.net> >>wrote: >> > >> >> If using a solutions manual to check one's understanding is cheating, >>why do they exist at all? Surely a professor, with an understanding of >>the subject vastly beyond that of the student, wouldn't need such an >>aid... >> Since solutions manuals can't be used in tests, but only as an aid in >>doing homework, which usually represents only a small percentage of a >>grade, they aren't going to gain a diploma for an unqualified person. >> Are they created and used as a way for professors to cheat their way >>through their careers? >> >>-- >>John > >Hi, > as far as I know, solutions manuals are for professors, not >for students. Homework problems, created by a book's >author, are exceedingly time-consuming to prepare, and >having ready-made homework problems/solutions save a >professor an awful lot of time. > >My recollection is that completing homework problems >counted for a *substantial* part of students grade, as >opposed to a "small percentage". If a student failed to >complete their homework problems, it seems to me that >they'd have to "ace" the tests just to receive a "C" grade. > >I will admit, if a guy is trying, at home on their own, to learn >a subject (say, digital filters for example) then a solutions >manual would be valuable.
My own experience was that homework problems counted for 5-10% of the grade; collaboration with other students to solve the problems was encouraged, so the grade component was just extra motivation rather than a means of evaluating individuals. By just copying and turning in answers, students would short-change themselves on test preparation and end up with lower grades. The far greater part of the grade came from tests and papers. -- John
Reply by glen herrmannsfeldt September 29, 20082008-09-29
Rick Lyons wrote:
(snip)

> as far as I know, solutions manuals are for professors, not > for students. Homework problems, created by a book's > author, are exceedingly time-consuming to prepare, and > having ready-made homework problems/solutions save a > professor an awful lot of time.
As I remember, it is the job of TAs to grade homework, discuss the solutions with the students, and otherwise do all the time consuming work.
> My recollection is that completing homework problems > counted for a *substantial* part of students grade, as > opposed to a "small percentage". If a student failed to > complete their homework problems, it seems to me that > they'd have to "ace" the tests just to receive a "C" grade.
Different for different classes and teachers. Even a small percentage would be unfair to those students who didn't have it. Hopefully the student with the answers doesn't just copy the answer, but actually works through the problem with the answer as a guide. Still, it would not be fair.
> I will admit, if a guy is trying, at home on their own, to learn > a subject (say, digital filters for example) then a solutions > manual would be valuable.
-- glen
Reply by dbell September 29, 20082008-09-29
On Sep 27, 5:33&#2013266080;pm, John O'Flaherty <quias...@yeeha.com> wrote:
> On Fri, 26 Sep 2008 20:11:12 -0500, Jack Klein <jackkl...@spamcop.net> > wrote: > > > > > > >On Fri, 26 Sep 2008 17:20:35 -0700 (PDT), awais <awais.e...@gmail.com> > >wrote in comp.dsp: > > >> Hello, > > >> I need solution's manual for Multirate Filters and Systems Banks by PP > >> Vaidyanathan. Thanks a lot. > > >I need 700,000,000,000.00 USD before those silly politicians give it > >to Wall Street. &#2013266080;If you can help me with what I need, I am sure I can > >help you with what you need. > > >Otherwise, if you cheat to get through school, some day in the future > >you might get a job you are not qualified for. &#2013266080;Perhaps you might even > >go to work for the very large International company that I work for, > >and someday wind up on a project with me. > > >Once I discovered your dishonesty and lack of qualifications, I would > >be obligated to have you fired, ruin your reputation, and perhaps even > >cause you bodily harm. > > >Surely you would feel guilty if you forced me to such extremes!! > > &#2013266080;If using a solutions manual to check one's understanding is cheating, > why do they exist at all? Surely a professor, with an understanding of > the subject vastly beyond that of the student, wouldn't need such an > aid... > &#2013266080;Since solutions manuals can't be used in tests, but only as an aid in > doing homework, which usually represents only a small percentage of a > grade, they aren't going to gain a diploma for an unqualified person. > &#2013266080;Are they created and used as a way for professors to cheat their way > through their careers? > > -- > John- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text -
John, A lot of the questions that are posted here come from unqualified people who got a diploma. Dirk
Reply by dbell September 29, 20082008-09-29
On Sep 29, 9:32&#2013266080;am, R.Lyons@_Bogus_ieee.org (Rick Lyons) wrote:
> On Sat, 27 Sep 2008 16:33:26 -0500, John O'Flaherty > > > > > > <quias...@yeeha.com> wrote: > >On Fri, 26 Sep 2008 20:11:12 -0500, Jack Klein <jackkl...@spamcop.net> > >wrote: > > > If using a solutions manual to check one's understanding is cheating, > >why do they exist at all? Surely a professor, with an understanding of > >the subject vastly beyond that of the student, wouldn't need such an > >aid... > > Since solutions manuals can't be used in tests, but only as an aid in > >doing homework, which usually represents only a small percentage of a > >grade, they aren't going to gain a diploma for an unqualified person. > > Are they created and used as a way for professors to cheat their way > >through their careers? > > >-- > >John > > Hi, > &#2013266080; as far as I know, solutions manuals are for professors, not > for students. &#2013266080;Homework problems, created by a book's > author, are exceedingly time-consuming to prepare, and > having ready-made homework problems/solutions save a > professor an awful lot of time. &#2013266080; > > My recollection is that completing homework problems > counted for a *substantial* part of students grade, as > opposed to a "small percentage". &#2013266080;If a student failed to > complete their homework problems, it seems to me that > they'd have to "ace" the tests just to receive a "C" grade. > > I will admit, if a guy is trying, at home on their own, to learn > a subject (say, digital filters for example) then a solutions > manual would be valuable. > > See Ya', > [-Rick-]- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text -
Hi Rick, If a guy is trying, at home on their own, then they need a few different references, and at least one that has a lot of solved problems (Schaum's Outline?). I don't think the OP is a guy who is "trying". Check his other posts. Dirk
Reply by Rick Lyons September 29, 20082008-09-29
On Fri, 26 Sep 2008 20:11:12 -0500, Jack Klein <jackklein@spamcop.net>
wrote:

>On Fri, 26 Sep 2008 17:20:35 -0700 (PDT), awais <awais.engr@gmail.com> >wrote in comp.dsp: > >> >> Hello, >> >> I need solution's manual for Multirate Filters and Systems Banks by PP >> Vaidyanathan. Thanks a lot. > >I need 700,000,000,000.00 USD before those silly politicians give it >to Wall Street. If you can help me with what I need, I am sure I can >help you with what you need. > >Otherwise, if you cheat to get through school, some day in the future >you might get a job you are not qualified for. Perhaps you might even >go to work for the very large International company that I work for, >and someday wind up on a project with me. > >Once I discovered your dishonesty and lack of qualifications, I would >be obligated to have you fired, ruin your reputation, and perhaps even >cause you bodily harm. > >Surely you would feel guilty if you forced me to such extremes!! > >-- >Jack Klein
Hi, Jack, instead of "sugar-coating" your reply, I think you should tell awais how you *really* feel. :-) [-Rick-]
Reply by Rick Lyons September 29, 20082008-09-29
On Sat, 27 Sep 2008 16:33:26 -0500, John O'Flaherty
<quiasmox@yeeha.com> wrote:

>On Fri, 26 Sep 2008 20:11:12 -0500, Jack Klein <jackklein@spamcop.net> >wrote: >
> > If using a solutions manual to check one's understanding is cheating, >why do they exist at all? Surely a professor, with an understanding of >the subject vastly beyond that of the student, wouldn't need such an >aid... > Since solutions manuals can't be used in tests, but only as an aid in >doing homework, which usually represents only a small percentage of a >grade, they aren't going to gain a diploma for an unqualified person. > Are they created and used as a way for professors to cheat their way >through their careers? > >-- >John
Hi, as far as I know, solutions manuals are for professors, not for students. Homework problems, created by a book's author, are exceedingly time-consuming to prepare, and having ready-made homework problems/solutions save a professor an awful lot of time. My recollection is that completing homework problems counted for a *substantial* part of students grade, as opposed to a "small percentage". If a student failed to complete their homework problems, it seems to me that they'd have to "ace" the tests just to receive a "C" grade. I will admit, if a guy is trying, at home on their own, to learn a subject (say, digital filters for example) then a solutions manual would be valuable. See Ya', [-Rick-]
Reply by awais September 29, 20082008-09-29
Well I need solution manual only to verify my answers and to check the
understanding of this subject
Its not a bad practice
What can one do if he is not able to grasp the concept, he will not be
able to solve the exercise problems and then eventually he will take
help from the solutions manual

If you people cant help me then point out some great resources on
Multirate Filters and Banks (Polyphase structures, Multistage
Structures and QMF type resources)

How can I increase the knowledge of this subject and how can I master
this subject?

Mr. Jack Klein needs to follow up........

Thansk a lot for your posts, most of the people took my post in a
wrong sense and thought it of some kind of plagiarism or cheating
i dont think it to be
Reply by glen herrmannsfeldt September 29, 20082008-09-29
John O'Flaherty wrote:
(snip)

> If using a solutions manual to check one's understanding is cheating, > why do they exist at all? Surely a professor, with an understanding of > the subject vastly beyond that of the student, wouldn't need such an > aid...
Professors are busy, and can use all the help they can get. Presumably in most cases they will verify the answer in the solution manual, but it is convenient.
> Since solutions manuals can't be used in tests, but only as an aid in > doing homework, which usually represents only a small percentage of a > grade, they aren't going to gain a diploma for an unqualified person. > Are they created and used as a way for professors to cheat their way > through their careers?
Well, many books give the answers to odd numbered problems. Even though it is only a small percentage of the grade, it would still be unfair for some students to have that small advantage. I do agree, though, if the professor couldn't do the problems without help then they shouldn't be teaching the course. If they could, but faster with help, that should be allowed. -- glen
Reply by John O'Flaherty September 27, 20082008-09-27
On Fri, 26 Sep 2008 20:11:12 -0500, Jack Klein <jackklein@spamcop.net>
wrote:

>On Fri, 26 Sep 2008 17:20:35 -0700 (PDT), awais <awais.engr@gmail.com> >wrote in comp.dsp: > >> >> Hello, >> >> I need solution's manual for Multirate Filters and Systems Banks by PP >> Vaidyanathan. Thanks a lot. > >I need 700,000,000,000.00 USD before those silly politicians give it >to Wall Street. If you can help me with what I need, I am sure I can >help you with what you need. > >Otherwise, if you cheat to get through school, some day in the future >you might get a job you are not qualified for. Perhaps you might even >go to work for the very large International company that I work for, >and someday wind up on a project with me. > >Once I discovered your dishonesty and lack of qualifications, I would >be obligated to have you fired, ruin your reputation, and perhaps even >cause you bodily harm. > >Surely you would feel guilty if you forced me to such extremes!!
If using a solutions manual to check one's understanding is cheating, why do they exist at all? Surely a professor, with an understanding of the subject vastly beyond that of the student, wouldn't need such an aid... Since solutions manuals can't be used in tests, but only as an aid in doing homework, which usually represents only a small percentage of a grade, they aren't going to gain a diploma for an unqualified person. Are they created and used as a way for professors to cheat their way through their careers? -- John