Hi all. Yesterday evening I drove across a mountain. At this time of the year, driving conditions are awkward, insofar as the road is bare (no covers of snow) but wet, and the tempereature hovers around freezing, so that one does not really know whether one drives on a wet road or on a thin layer of ice. On this particular mountain pass, reindeers and other wildlife is a factor to be reckoned with (I was lucky, all I saw was one lone moose by the road), so it gets quite tiresome to drive for hours in the darkness at night. So I had passed this mountain. Rain, wet/icy road, wildlife... When I descend to the valley beyond the mountain I saw some stars above the hills. I needed a rest from the driving, so I drove off the main road onto a dirt road, and stopped a couple of hundred meters into the woods. There were no clouds above me. I was at some 500 m altitude, in the dryest part of the county. I hadn't met a car for ages, so I had almost perfect night vision. I stepped out of the car and I got completely overwhelmed of what I saw above me. The milky way was crystal clear, I could see the ghost-like Andromeda clear as I never saw it. I mounted my spotting scope I always bring on these kinds of trips (I had used it earlyer on the trip to view a young Emperor Eagle, and later a swan). Vega almost blinded me when I found it, the double-double was crisp clear and I could almost see the hole in the ring nebula M57. Usually, at sea level, finding the ring nebula is the difficult part with this scope. This time the problem was to find out exactly which of the faint objects I should focus on; trying to focus the nebula into a dot is no good... It doesn't happen very often that I envy people who live in the deserts, but after seeing the crisp clear skies yesterday, I kind of envy the people who live in places like Arizona, Nevada, and other dry, high places with clear dark skies every night. Yesterday, I could use the stars that usually are the faintest I can see, as crisp clear guidelights for doing star-hopping to find the targets I wanted to look at. Awesome! Rune
OT: On seeing stars...
Started by ●October 13, 2004
Reply by ●October 13, 20042004-10-13
On 13 Oct 2004 04:00:55 -0700, allnor@tele.ntnu.no (Rune Allnor) wrote:>Hi all. >(snipped)> >The milky way was crystal clear, I could see the ghost-like Andromeda >clear as I never saw it. I mounted my spotting scope I always bring on >these kinds of trips (I had used it earlyer on the trip to view a young >Emperor Eagle, and later a swan). Vega almost blinded me when I >found it, the double-double was crisp clear and I could almost see the >hole in the ring nebula M57. Usually, at sea level, finding the ring >nebula is the difficult part with this scope. This time the problem was >to find out exactly which of the faint objects I should focus on; trying >to focus the nebula into a dot is no good... > >It doesn't happen very often that I envy people who live in the deserts, >but after seeing the crisp clear skies yesterday, I kind of envy the >people who live in places like Arizona, Nevada, and other dry, high >places with clear dark skies every night. Yesterday, I could use the >stars that usually are the faintest I can see, as crisp clear guidelights >for doing star-hopping to find the targets I wanted to look at. > >Awesome! > >RuneHi Rune, nice story. The first time I saw the Milky Way, while camping out in some park when I was in my twenties, I didn't know what it was. Growing up in a city, I'd never seen it before. I looked at the night sky that night and wondered, "Humm, what a "strange" thin, wispy, cloud in the night sky." But as I continued gazing, it hit me. WAIT A MINUTE - THAT'S THE MILKY WAY!!! I was astounded. [-Rick-]
Reply by ●October 13, 20042004-10-13
Rune Allnor wrote:> It doesn't happen very often that I envy people who live in the > deserts, but after seeing the crisp clear skies yesterday, I > kind of envy the people who live in places like Arizona, Nevada, > and other dry, high places with clear dark skies every night. > Yesterday, I could use the stars that usually are the faintest I > can see, as crisp clear guidelights for doing star-hopping to > find the targets I wanted to look at.And now I'm envious of you ;) If you haven't already heard, there's a lunar eclipse coming on, at the end of the month in middle europe. Martin -- Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum viditur.
Reply by ●October 13, 20042004-10-13
"Rune Allnor" <allnor@tele.ntnu.no> wrote in message news:f56893ae.0410130300.4edc0d50@posting.google.com...> Hi all. >Rune's neat story snipped! A few years back I went camping in the middle of Yosemite National park in California. The campsite was right at the treeline (9600 Feet about sea level). This altitude combined with being over 20 miles from the nearest road plus add to that the high mountians between me and the sparse light polution sources, the sky was incrediably dark. I had never seen so many stars. In fact there were so many visable stars I had a hard time recognizing the constellations. In Atlanta, we can only see the bright stars. And I live 20 miles from downtown! The week I was in YNP, was moonless, and the starlight was so bright I could walk (slowly) at 3:00 in the morning without a light. I was sorry I didn't bring a telescope, but all of the gear was packed in on muleback, and we each had a 35 lb gear limit. One fun task I had was teaching my fellow campers how to tell time by the stars. That sorta got it by the end of the week. The pack guide understood it, but he had been an Eagle scout, so I think he had done this before. Clay p.s. WE can get some good viewing in the Atlanta area to the east of the city. Georgia State University has an observatory there http://www.chara.gsu.edu/HLCO/index.html Of course with better viewing on a mountain top in California, GSU also has this observatory http://www.chara.gsu.edu/CHARA/
Reply by ●October 13, 20042004-10-13
In article <f56893ae.0410130300.4edc0d50@posting.google.com>, Rune Allnor <allnor@tele.ntnu.no> wrote:>[snip] >The milky way was crystal clear, I could see the ghost-like Andromeda >clear as I never saw it. >[snip] >It doesn't happen very often that I envy people who live in the deserts, >but after seeing the crisp clear skies yesterday, I kind of envy the >people who live in places like Arizona, Nevada, and other dry, high >places with clear dark skies every night.In the summer months, particularly August, the night sky is facing the center of the Milky Way galaxy. One clear August night while driving on a lonely highway in Arizona, I stopped the car and walked a ways into the desert to relieve myself. While going about my business I chanced to look up, and nearly fell over backwards in awe (which would have made a mess considering what I was doing). One could actually see the Milky Way galaxy in all its glory, with the central bulge right overhead, and both galactic arms stretching out from horizon to horizon. The intellectual knowledge that we're inside the edge of a disc-shaped galaxy with a central bulge is one thing. It's another thing entirely to SEE that galaxy, and SEE our place in it. I never thought it was possible until then. In photographs I have found since then, the central bulge and arms are especially apparent when the Milky Way is photographed through a fish-eye lens with a red filter. Imagine this picture stretched out over the whole sky occupying your entire field of vision: http://www.mreclipse.com/Astrophoto/SS97/97SS22w.JPG Interactive panoramic view of the Milky Way sky: http://canopus.physik.uni-potsdam.de/~axm/mwpan_vr.html -Alex
Reply by ●October 13, 20042004-10-13
allnor@tele.ntnu.no (Rune Allnor) wrote in message news:<f56893ae.0410130300.4edc0d50@posting.google.com>...> I mounted my spotting scope I always bring on > these kinds of trips (I had used it earlyer on the trip to view a young > Emperor Eagle, and later a swan).Well, I thought the eagle I saw was a young "Konge�rn" (Eng. Golden Eagle, Lat. Aquila chrysaetos) which is a far cry from the Imperial Eagle (Aquila Heliaca) which apparently only habitate around the Black Sea. After having checked my references, I believe it was a young white-tail eagle (Albicilla Haliaetus), mainly because of the distinctly wedge- shaped tail and the lack of certain marks on the wings that would be expected in young golden eagles. I can't really explain why I misidentified the eagle. Perhaps the fact that I was some 200 km from the coast was to blame, I don't know. Rune
Reply by ●October 13, 20042004-10-13
Rune, Very cool! I guess I'm lucky to have grown up in a rural area where seeing the Milky Way was something normal. Living in an urban area now I miss it, but here in Arizona you don't have to go too far out of town to see it. In the summer I try to spend several weeks at our family's property in South Dakota, which is very rural and has an elevation close to a mile. The Milky Way is usually quite bright there. I discovered, though, that there's a lot of air turbulence over the Black Hills that prevents good viewing of any celestial details with a telescope. :( The turbulence was bad enough that I can see things better from my back porch in Scottsdale than I could from BFE South Dakota, which was surprising. Even with the ambient light from the city the stable air in Arizona makes it pretty easy to pick out details in planets, etc. A friend from San Diego came and visited at the cabin in SoDak when I was up there this year. The first night he was there he remarked about how astonishing it was to see the Milky Way again after being in the city for so long. I think it's really cool that so many people share that feeling from such a simple thing. ;) Your note is timely, as I just got back from a short trip from here to Santa Fe, NM and back, and we took my girlfriend's telescope (which is better than mine) with us. We stayed overnight in Greer, AZ, which is way up in mountains and the Milky Way was out in force. Unfortunately it was also really cold up there (for me, anyway, I'm a total wuss when it comes to cold), and we didn't spend a lot of time looking at stars. What we did see was great, though. On 13 Oct 2004 04:00:55 -0700, allnor@tele.ntnu.no (Rune Allnor) wrote:>Hi all. > >Yesterday evening I drove across a mountain. At this time of the >year, driving conditions are awkward, insofar as the road is bare >(no covers of snow) but wet, and the tempereature hovers around >freezing, so that one does not really know whether one drives on >a wet road or on a thin layer of ice. On this particular mountain >pass, reindeers and other wildlife is a factor to be reckoned with >(I was lucky, all I saw was one lone moose by the road), so it gets >quite tiresome to drive for hours in the darkness at night. > >So I had passed this mountain. Rain, wet/icy road, wildlife... >When I descend to the valley beyond the mountain I saw some stars >above the hills. I needed a rest from the driving, so I drove off >the main road onto a dirt road, and stopped a couple of hundred >meters into the woods. > >There were no clouds above me. I was at some 500 m altitude, in the >dryest part of the county. I hadn't met a car for ages, so I had >almost perfect night vision. I stepped out of the car and I got >completely overwhelmed of what I saw above me. > >The milky way was crystal clear, I could see the ghost-like Andromeda >clear as I never saw it. I mounted my spotting scope I always bring on >these kinds of trips (I had used it earlyer on the trip to view a young >Emperor Eagle, and later a swan). Vega almost blinded me when I >found it, the double-double was crisp clear and I could almost see the >hole in the ring nebula M57. Usually, at sea level, finding the ring >nebula is the difficult part with this scope. This time the problem was >to find out exactly which of the faint objects I should focus on; trying >to focus the nebula into a dot is no good... > >It doesn't happen very often that I envy people who live in the deserts, >but after seeing the crisp clear skies yesterday, I kind of envy the >people who live in places like Arizona, Nevada, and other dry, high >places with clear dark skies every night. Yesterday, I could use the >stars that usually are the faintest I can see, as crisp clear guidelights >for doing star-hopping to find the targets I wanted to look at. > >Awesome! > >RuneEric Jacobsen Minister of Algorithms, Intel Corp. My opinions may not be Intel's opinions. http://www.ericjacobsen.org
Reply by ●October 13, 20042004-10-13
Rune Allnor wrote:> Hi all. > > Yesterday evening I drove across a mountain. At this time of the > year, driving conditions are awkward, insofar as the road is bare > (no covers of snow) but wet, and the tempereature hovers around > freezing, so that one does not really know whether one drives on > a wet road or on a thin layer of ice. On this particular mountain > pass, reindeers and other wildlife is a factor to be reckoned with > (I was lucky, all I saw was one lone moose by the road), so it gets > quite tiresome to drive for hours in the darkness at night. > > So I had passed this mountain. Rain, wet/icy road, wildlife... > When I descend to the valley beyond the mountain I saw some stars > above the hills. I needed a rest from the driving, so I drove off > the main road onto a dirt road, and stopped a couple of hundred > meters into the woods. > > There were no clouds above me. I was at some 500 m altitude, in the > dryest part of the county. I hadn't met a car for ages, so I had > almost perfect night vision. I stepped out of the car and I got > completely overwhelmed of what I saw above me. > > The milky way was crystal clear, I could see the ghost-like Andromeda > clear as I never saw it. I mounted my spotting scope I always bring on > these kinds of trips (I had used it earlyer on the trip to view a young > Emperor Eagle, and later a swan). Vega almost blinded me when I > found it, the double-double was crisp clear and I could almost see the > hole in the ring nebula M57. Usually, at sea level, finding the ring > nebula is the difficult part with this scope. This time the problem was > to find out exactly which of the faint objects I should focus on; trying > to focus the nebula into a dot is no good... > > It doesn't happen very often that I envy people who live in the deserts, > but after seeing the crisp clear skies yesterday, I kind of envy the > people who live in places like Arizona, Nevada, and other dry, high > places with clear dark skies every night. Yesterday, I could use the > stars that usually are the faintest I can see, as crisp clear guidelights > for doing star-hopping to find the targets I wanted to look at. > > Awesome! > > RuneHow I envy you! I have rarely seen a really clear sky in the eastern US since I was a kid, spending a summer in Vermont. The air is too polluted, so even in daytime, what should be a rich blue has a gray cast. One night a few years ago in Chaco Canyon, there was one of those spectacular views, but that's 2000 miles from here, and I understand that light pollution is now encroaching even there. Once, camping high in the White Mountains of New Hampshire, I walked from my dark tent to the privy some time about 3:00 AM with a flashlight in my pocket, but not in use. (One can follow a trodden path by the feel of the ground underfoot.) I had the impression of seeing with my eyes as well as my feet, and stopped to look around. I saw a definite shadow on the ground, then two others. The light sources were Capella, Aldebaran, and Vega, if I identified them correctly. (Sirius was below the horizon.) That was a transcendent moment. I'm glad to see that you were equally moved. Let no one discourage these OT threads. They add a lot to our wholeness. Jerry -- Engineering is the art of making what you want from things you can get. �����������������������������������������������������������������������
Reply by ●October 13, 20042004-10-13
"Clay Turner" <physics@bellsouth.net> wrote> > Rune's neat story snipped! >Clay's story snipped too. :-) I used to do quite a bit of amatuer astronomy. A large group of us were camped out with the telescopes on a _really_ clear night. Then, one newbie pointed out that some clouds were heading our way to spoil our fun. It turned out the guy hadn't seen the Magellanic Clouds, and it was these that were "headed our way". (See e.g. http://www.seds.org/messier/xtra/ngc/lmc.html). On that night, they really did look like storm clouds they were so clear. Ciao, Peter K.
Reply by ●October 13, 20042004-10-13
Peter Kootsookos wrote:> "Clay Turner" <physics@bellsouth.net> wrote > >>Rune's neat story snipped! >> > > > Clay's story snipped too. :-) > > I used to do quite a bit of amatuer astronomy. A large group of us > were camped out with the telescopes on a _really_ clear night. Then, > one newbie pointed out that some clouds were heading our way to spoil > our fun. > > It turned out the guy hadn't seen the Magellanic Clouds, and it was > these that were "headed our way". (See e.g. > http://www.seds.org/messier/xtra/ngc/lmc.html). > > On that night, they really did look like storm clouds they were so > clear. > > Ciao, > > Peter K.Where was that? I've never seen them; They are Southern Hemisphere objects. Jerry -- Engineering is the art of making what you want from things you can get. �����������������������������������������������������������������������
