Eric Jacobsen wrote:> > On Sun, 13 Jul 2003 16:39:41 -0500, Dennis@NoSpam.com wrote: > > >ricklyon@REMOVE.onemain.com (Rick Lyons) wrote: > > > >>I now formally convey upon you > >>the official 'comp.dsp authorization' to > >>pat yourself on the back. > > > >Well the short history is I posted a question on this ng about an easy way to > >determine amplitudes and phases of unevenly spaced frequencies other than the > >Burg(MESA) algorithm. You guys said Goertzel, but only at the bin centers. > >After much computing with Goertzel I came back that Goertzel can find any > >frequency within the fs/2 band. You guys said nope. Then I discovered that the > >Goertzel phase was incorrect if not at a bin center and pointed out the > >Bonzanigo phase correction. You guys said nope. > > > >I decline the official 'comp.dsp' pat myself on the back award but appreciate > >and enjoy the back and forth correspondence and helpfulness of this ng. > > > >>By the way, we don't refer to me (Rick) as an > >>"old boy". I'm the old fart. (But not as old as > >>Jerry Avins. Jerry knew Abraham Lincoln personally.) > > > >I formally apologize for calling anyone on the dsp ng an "Old Boy". Perhaps I > >should have said "the dsp gang network heh?" :-) > > > >Dennis > > Dennis, > > It sounds to me like you're engaging in the time-tested practice of > generalizing attributions. I don't know who this "dsp gang network" > or "you guys" are, but internet newsgroups are collections of > individuals (well, usually, this one certainly is, anyway). My > recollections of the threads you mention above certainly don't come to > the conclusion of "you guys said nope." e.g., You brought up the > correction thing and demonstrated that it can be useful, from what I > could see. Other opinions may differ, which is the whole point, I > think. > > Try not to fall into the trap of attributing a particular opinion to > some imagined organized block of contributors here, because such a > thing does not exist. > > Eric Jacobsen > Minister of Algorithms, Intel Corp. > My opinions may not be Intel's opinions. > http://www.ericjacobsen.orgErik, I didn't see that Erik was serious about a DSP steering committee. I took his remark to be just a bit of humor to cover the inevitable awkwardness that went with patting himself on the back while blowing his own horn. If "nope" was indeed the response -- I don't remember the thread -- then it was wrong. A mistake isn't a sin, any more than it's the judgment of a cabal. Jerry -- Engineering is the art of making what you want from things you can get. �����������������������������������������������������������������������
Another Goertzel question
Started by ●July 5, 2003
Reply by ●July 14, 20032003-07-14
Reply by ●July 14, 20032003-07-14
>I now formally convey upon you > the official 'comp.dsp authorization' to > pat yourself on the back. >LOL :=)
Reply by ●July 14, 20032003-07-14
On Sun, 13 Jul 2003 00:34:23 GMT, ricklyon@REMOVE.onemain.com (Rick Lyons) wrote: Hi Guys, I was recently in the MicroCenter store in San Jose California. They used to have lots of DSP books but the selection has dwindled to just 5-6 books. Anyway, under the "Goertzel' topic in a DSP book by Stein, he said "k must be an integer". So now I don't feel too bad about falling into the trap of assuming k must be an integer. [-Rick-]
Reply by ●July 20, 20032003-07-20
On Mon, 07 Jul 2003 16:26:57 GMT, Al Clark <dsp@danvillesignal.com> wrote:>ricklyon@REMOVE.onemain.com (Rick Lyons) wrote in news:3f092dd4.11305359 >@news.earthlink.net: > >> On Mon, 07 Jul 2003 06:25:53 GMT, eric.jacobsen@ieee.org (Eric >> Jacobsen) wrote: >> >> (snipped) >>>> >>>>Hi Steve, >>>> Clay's explanation of my "narrow view" of the values of k is >>>> correct. Every Goertzel description I've ever read starts out with: >>>> >>>> "You can use the Goertzel algorithm to compute the >>>> k-th bin of an N-point DFT." >>>> >>>>And then the author gives the math derivation of how Goertzel >>>>computes some N-point DFT bin result. >>>>Because the bin indices (k = 0,1,2,3..) for the DFT are integers >>>>I fell into the trap of thinking k had to be an integer. >>>>But when you look at the equations, and the Goertzel block >>>>diagram, as you say there's nothing there forcing k to be >>>>an integer. >>>> >>>>Live and learn, huh? >>>>This newsgroup is the greatest! >>>>[-Rick-] >>> >>> >>>Rick, all, >>> >>>Sorry to be coming into this late... >>> >>>Usually Goertzel's algorithm is used as a shortcut to simplify >>>computation of DFT bins of interest, so the identified conceptual >>>relationship to DFTs does tend to get in the way sometimes. >>> >>>Realize, though, that even for DFTs the indices are integers to >>>maintain orthogonality wrt the reference functions, but if one wants >>>to interpolate in the frequency domain with a DFT then k doesn't have >>>to be an integer there, either. As Steve pointed out the Goertzel >>>algorithm does have some flexibility in matching k and N to achieve >>>the desired output. >>> >>>The sliding-window DFT bins can be adjusted similarly. As usual, as >>>long as one keeps track of what they're doing many things are >>>possible, but there may be tradeoffs. >>> >>>Wasn't there an article about such things in a recent SP Mag? >>> >>>BTW, Rick, congratulations on becoming an IEEE Fellow! >>> >>>...didja think we wouldn't notice? ;) >>> >> >> Hi Eric, >> thanks for the nice words, but I have no idea what you're >> referring to. (Sorry for the poor grammar.) >> Is it possible that you have me mixed up with some >> other 'Lyons'? >> >> Humm, I wonder how I can check this out. >> >> Thanks, >> [-Rick-] >> >> > >The IEEE award in question went to Richard Lyon (not Lyons). I'm sure our >Rick deserves some kind of award as well, maybe next time.....Hi Al, Ya know, there's a Rick Lyon that's posted here a few times in the past. Wonder if he's the award winner. Thanks for the post Al. [-Rick-]
Reply by ●July 20, 20032003-07-20
On Mon, 07 Jul 2003 17:31:02 GMT, eric.jacobsen@ieee.org (Eric Jacobsen) wrote: (snipped)>>>> >>>>BTW, Rick, congratulations on becoming an IEEE Fellow! >>>> >>>>...didja think we wouldn't notice? ;) >>>> >>> >>> Hi Eric, >>> thanks for the nice words, but I have no idea what you're >>> referring to. (Sorry for the poor grammar.) >>> Is it possible that you have me mixed up with some >>> other 'Lyons'? >>> >>> Humm, I wonder how I can check this out. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> [-Rick-] >>> >>> >> >>The IEEE award in question went to Richard Lyon (not Lyons). I'm sure our >>Rick deserves some kind of award as well, maybe next time..... > > >Ack! It's not the same guy!? My apologies. > >This means that there are two of them loose out there doing nearly the >same things! >Hi Eric, Whew! Thanks for the clarification. I'm not sure I want any part of an organization that would have me as a member.* Ha ha ha ha [-Rick-] * Stolen from Groucho Marks
Reply by ●July 21, 20032003-07-21
Read http://www.isip.msstate.edu/conferences/dsp95/paper_dtmf.pdf page 5 to see why k does not have to be an integer. Dennis ricklyon@REMOVE.onemain.com (Rick Lyons) wrote:>On Sun, 13 Jul 2003 00:34:23 GMT, ricklyon@REMOVE.onemain.com (Rick >Lyons) wrote: > > >Hi Guys, > I was recently in the MicroCenter store in San Jose >California. They used to have lots of DSP books but the >selection has dwindled to just 5-6 books. >Anyway, under the "Goertzel' topic in a DSP book by Stein, >he said "k must be an integer". So now I don't feel too >bad about falling into the trap of assuming k must be an >integer. > >[-Rick-] >
Reply by ●July 22, 20032003-07-22
Thanks, very useful! Marcell Dennis@NoSpam.com wrote in news:nc3ohv8knrh3pf3l1cepkn2k956ip1a5v4@4ax.com:> Read http://www.isip.msstate.edu/conferences/dsp95/paper_dtmf.pdf page 5 > to see why k does not have to be an integer. > > Dennis > >
Reply by ●July 22, 20032003-07-22
On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 11:00:20 -0500, Dennis@NoSpam.com wrote:>Read http://www.isip.msstate.edu/conferences/dsp95/paper_dtmf.pdf page 5 >to see why k does not have to be an integer. > >DennisThanks Dennis, I downloaded the paper. [-Rick-]
Reply by ●September 30, 20032003-09-30
Hi Rick, I am just writing multichannel DTMF detection routine (I use SPRA096A app. note from TI) for DSP56300, and as understand should use fractional k ? Have no time to check it with Matlab, so may I trust you ? ;-) Best Roman Rumian Rick Lyons wrote:> On Sun, 13 Jul 2003 00:34:23 GMT, ricklyon@REMOVE.onemain.com (Rick > Lyons) wrote: > > > Hi Guys, > I was recently in the MicroCenter store in San Jose > California. They used to have lots of DSP books but the > selection has dwindled to just 5-6 books. > Anyway, under the "Goertzel' topic in a DSP book by Stein, > he said "k must be an integer". So now I don't feel too > bad about falling into the trap of assuming k must be an > integer. > > [-Rick-] > >
Reply by ●October 10, 20032003-10-10
On Tue, 30 Sep 2003 21:44:30 +0200, Roman Rumian <rumian@agh.edu.pl> wrote:>Hi Rick, > >I am just writing multichannel DTMF detection routine (I use SPRA096A >app. note from TI) for DSP56300, and as understand should use fractional k ? > >Have no time to check it with Matlab, so may I trust you ? ;-) > >Best > >Roman Rumian >Hi Roman (hope all is well with you) Yes, you can trust me. ;-) [-Rick-]
